stuart
Getting There Member
Posts: 16
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Post by stuart on Dec 31, 2006 15:56:58 GMT 1
Hello there . I am in Wetherby and have recently bought a beautiful Pacific Blue Karmann Cab. It is concours standard with a 1914 engine (sporty twin cabs, Porsche wheels and a big stainless steel exhaust). The person who made up the engine put on lots of high performance extras ... like an external oil filter behind the left rear wing. Two nights ago at 11pm it began pissing out oil from the seal on this filter. It make have just been a dodgy seal, it may have been unsuited to the oil pressures this engine generates, or it may just have been caught on a sleeping policeman as the car is seriously lowered. It was pretty awful anyway. There is also an active oil pump in there so unfortunately ALL the oil seemed to have come out somewhere between Allwoodley and Harewood. If you see a line on the A61 road going north.... that was me! Eventually I was in the dark and rain between Harewood and Collingham, trying to lash up the leak in the filter seal, pouring in gallons of oil, when the red dash lights came on and power died. Then followed a long walk home and a recovery truck back to Wetherby at 3am, whereby Rufus the cab is now back home there too. He is still pretty empty of oil and the engine isnt turning from the starter motor but battery power is low. Being a little deflated I have just covered him over and apart from crying a bit I am trying to work out how to heal him... He may be OK but I suspect the lack of oil will have been a very bad thing... even though I was topping it up and it was cold and I wasn't thrashing him...once I could see the oil was pissing out... I am unfamiliar with who can help up here and I would appreciate any help going...I have no air cool friends up here yet but was planning to make some... not quite this soon though! I have some questions before I get down and dirty. 1) If I have overheated how bad is it likely to be? Could I need a new engine block? If so this one was custom made in Essex... do I go back there or can I be helped locally? Could I just lose power from oil pressure or is it an indication that this is going to be serious? 2) I thought I could try and take out the plugs and see if it will turn over.. is this the best plan... What is the normal overheat assessment test as I dont want to snap anything that is already warped.... Bump starting could just leave a rubber stripe on the ground if things are siezed....Where can I lever the engine around? Should I just leave this to a real engineer? 3) Where is the best Beetle garage which could cope with an unhappy souped up 1914 150BHP sports engine with a Porsche cooling system? 4) Can anyone lend me any axle stands , moral support etc and come and help assess the damage 5) Which Beetle doctor do you all go to in times of trouble? I think there is someone in York and another in Bradford..... anyone wonderful in our area? Thanks for letting me share my tale of Woe Stuart (Wetherby)
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Post by keredewor on Dec 31, 2006 17:26:33 GMT 1
Stuart. You can turn the engine over with Porsche Type cooling fans...no problem, so here goes Recharge battery Repair the leaks/replace damaged filter housing Top up the oil Whip out the plugs Will it turn over (Try a suitable sized ring spanner on the cooling fan nut or at the bottom pulley) OR with the battery charged turn it over via the starter motor Is it turning over OK.....Yes Clean and replace plugs Fire it up Check for oil leaks Run it untill you attain 160deg or thereabouts, any visible signs of damage??....any knocking not previously heard.... if no and if it attains heat slowly you should be okay THEN Engine should not be smoking If its smoking badly rings are knacked and that's better news than a seized engine. If you can get it running be a good idea to get it in to a local garage to have a compression test carried out, the clubs sponsors can help you out www.rpmspecialistcars.co.uk/Next job....raise the oil filter, by the way the original problem sounds like crankcase overpressure, has your rocker covers got pressure relieving points back to an oil catch can? Hope that helps, let us know if you need any further info.
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stuart
Getting There Member
Posts: 16
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Post by stuart on Dec 31, 2006 20:26:03 GMT 1
This is a very helpful reply and just what I am after. I will have a go in the next week and will get back to you. I can see where the oil seal blew. But its hard to know why. Once we are running I would like a second opinion. I have only had this cab for a month and it hasnt done many miles since it was built. The enge can be replaced and wasnt the reason I bought him. I suspect it may not be a stable design and I would hate to make the same mistake twice. Do our sponsors love air cooled engines enough to be be sound advisors ... or is that something we all talk about in private off list? Do the club meetings allow that sort of group inspection?
Thanks again .. Is your name Karedewor... otherwise thanks and happy new year whover you are!
Stu
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Post by keredewor on Jan 1, 2007 12:17:37 GMT 1
Stuart
Is it the oil seal between the (aluminium) casting of the oil filter and the (Steel) Jacson connnector? or did the seal blow elsewhere....either way if the oil re-circulation system was fitted correctly with no previous leaks it is probably a symptom of high crankcase pressure and the leak has found the weakest point within the oil re-circulation system, could be many reasons for the actual leak you just have to thoroughly check all the connections and it will be apparent what went wrong.
Nick and Andy at RPM have 35 years Porsche Air cooled experience behind them as far as I am concerned they can be totally trusted, once you discover what has happened you can talk to them and they will help you all they can....but their are others that other club members use so its up to you.
I have known Andy and Nick a long time and their knowledge and willingness to help is unquestionable...........BUT for me I would try and sort it yourself first if you can and if you want to that is.
Derek aka Keredewor!!!
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stuart
Getting There Member
Posts: 16
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Post by stuart on Jan 1, 2007 13:07:13 GMT 1
Thanks Derek, (I suspected that you were backward but could deal with it! ) You have this all very well pictured. The seal blew just where you suggest, on the inside so it was very hard to see in the dark. I was lucky the exhaust was cold or it all could have gone up in smoke. I am struggling for time for the next few weeks but I do fancy starting this off myself and if I can get the plugs out I think siezed or not is potentially within my capabilities. ...
If the crank case pressure was too high as you suggest... are you implying that the engine was exposed to excessive RPM? I am unaware that I could do this on that last journey. If so I need extra dash guages with RPM if possible. My event happened just after several speed bumps which I took slow. In my mind I can picture the filter getting stretched outwards and backwards away from where it is fixed to the body. This would allow the seal to blow exactly where it is prolapsed out. Is there another mechanical reason for excessive crank case pressure? I dont know if there are other release points in the rocker boxes as you suggest. If this seal was too puny then do I really need this filter? It let out the oil far too easily!
Hopefully it wont take long for me to learn about active cooling like this, but my last two beetles ( well loved) were a 58 and 62 and traditional and that was well over a decade ago. This one shifts, but I would like stability built in there too. I have a great deal to learn and would like a professional on the job as well as whatever I do. Its far too nice a car for my limited skills.
thanks again
Stu
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Post by keredewor on Jan 1, 2007 19:11:28 GMT 1
Stu
When you have time to look at it drop me an e mail or pm me and I will come and have a look with you if I am around and I may be able to suggest what the problem was/is..., I only live in Knaresborough
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stuart
Getting There Member
Posts: 16
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Post by stuart on Jan 2, 2007 21:44:19 GMT 1
Cool!
I would like that... Still trying to find time to get the plugs out!
Thanks
S
Also.. how do we put pictures into posts like this?
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Post by keredewor on Jan 2, 2007 21:57:50 GMT 1
I post up pics by copying the pic to photobucket then copying the link from photobucket to the post
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stuart
Getting There Member
Posts: 16
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Post by stuart on Jan 10, 2007 19:06:48 GMT 1
Just to let you know that the engine is apparently cream crackered and a new unit is being located. I will try and open up the carcase and see what the real damage is later this year but it spins no more.
Will try and drive to meet on the next sunday club day but making no promises. What the thingyens is a photobucket?
Stu
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Post by 67looker on Jan 10, 2007 21:39:22 GMT 1
Hi Stu, Photobucket is a photo hosting website. You can upload digital or scanned images into a personal folder then cut and paste into other websites or forums. photobucket.comIts all pretty simple and doesn't take long to register a free account. Cheers, Jon
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stuart
Getting There Member
Posts: 16
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Post by stuart on Jan 23, 2007 20:42:43 GMT 1
Appartently heavy duty oil pressure release valves cause this to happen... Can anyone advise between Harry Harpics (who made this engine) , Type2 Detectives (Cambs) and a bloke named Paul H from Manchester (I will get his details from Terrys Beetles in the morning) to custom build a reliable high torque engine to replace the one I stuffed up? Who else builds custom engines up North? HH said cold oil was the cause!
HH seemed to get a very bad report from XXX @ Terrys Beetles... XX said reliability wasnt in the mix...
If I rebuild/build an engine I will try and get oil pressure and temp guages too. RPS will just fit engines but will not build...
Or... can I buy a temporary unit from anyone in the club?
In deciding who to go to ... I should maybe comment that I also want to put headrests in the back to protect my daughters necks if I prang.... who locally will modify my back seat upright with reinforced headrests? The lapbelts are dodgy.
So ... can anyone from the club suggest who to I contact for build and fit quotes. If this is a bit too political for the site I can be reached at hohovet@aol.com...
RPM seem great as a go between... but who makes the engine?
Anyone have a spare engine for now?
Stu x
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Post by 66westy64bug on Jan 23, 2007 21:45:34 GMT 1
Stuart I'm sure Derek will know someone. I've not had a performance engine built, but I know Steve aka daisybus is friends with a chap in northallerton that build performance engines for vw's and he is a member of the vwdrc. I know that he builds engines for a lot of vw drag cars. I'm not sure of his business name but can find out.
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Post by keredewor on Jan 24, 2007 20:39:11 GMT 1
Stuart Heavy duty oil relief = INCREASED Crankcase Oil Pressure @ Cold = EXACTLY why the weakest part of your full flow oil system went BANG.....its the point of least resistance in an aluminium oil filter housing against a High Tensile Steel JCT Coupling. Any recourse on Harry Harpics In any event Paul Medhurst at T2D/T3D is absolutely fine..........he can be relied on.......totally, I talked to him yesterday and RPM about your engine/car and asked Paul to make sure he looks after you....don't worry, he is a top guy and TOTALLY reliable. By the way Nick/Andy @ RPM have no hang ups over this they just want you to be a satisfied customer/VW owner. Paul can also sort out your rear seat headrests/belts. Derek
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stuart
Getting There Member
Posts: 16
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Post by stuart on Jan 25, 2007 19:24:58 GMT 1
Rock'n'roll!
I have put T2D into action and feel confident thay something a little less extreme but more stable will do the job. (Apparently you drive their engines!)We are thinking a 1776 unit with the cooling and bits transferred. (I wouldnt mind chucking the trumpet tail pipes for something a bit less pimpish if you have seen them!). Paid a deposit and will post this Cab down when they move to their new yard. This time we will have oil pressure and temp guages and will review the pressure relief.... a cage rear seat would be ideal so the children are protected. I have been talking to someone in Essex about this but I'll see how this pans out with Paul.
Thanks again... Two or three weeks and I'll be up and running again! I've met some good people along the way so far! I miss that smell of VW Stu
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